OK, the title summarizes the problem, and here's how I determine this is true:

1. The GVWR for my 1707T is 3840 lbs, according to the CD-132 form inside the trailer.
2. The UVW, which includes ALL manufacturer installed equipment is listed as 3001 lbs.
3. The weight of filled fresh water (36 gals) is given as 299 lbs and the weight of propane (9 gals) is given as 40 lbs.
4. This leaves 500 lbs as the additional Cargo Carrying Capacity (CCC).
5. According to the trailer manual, the hitch weight should be between approximately 12-15% of the full load weight, or 461-576 lbs at the GVWR.
5. There is NO "dealer installed equipment". Everything in the trailer is shown as "Optional Equipment Installed By Manufacturer. So, I conclude I should be able to add 500 more pounds of cargo to the trailer, with full water and propane and still remain within the weight limit.
6. I have added an additional battery, weighing approximately 50 lbs, most of which would be added to the hitch weight.
7. Additional cargo included pots, pans and dishes under the sink and microwave (maybe 20 pounds total).

The trailer is connected to my tow vehicle, a 2005 F150 SCrew, with an Equal-I-Zer Sway Control Hitch. The trailer is level while being towed and the compression difference at the truck axles are within 3/4" of the unloaded measurements.

On a public scale, with full fresh water and propane, I found the trailer axle weight was 3320 lbs. The axle is rated at 3500 lbs and the OEM tires (Goodyear 205/75R15 LR C) were rated at 1820 lbs each. It is clear that the axle loading is VERY close to the rated limits of the axle and the tires.

But - I then measured the weight at the trailer hitch (using the "bathroom scale" method) and found it to be 705 lbs! This brings the GVW of the trailer to 4025 lbs, which is 185 lbs over the limit.

My OEM tires on the trailer both failed due to cord separation in the second year, at less than 5000 miles. They were ALWAYS inflated to 50 psi (cold), and I always kept my tow speeds near 65 mph.

Additionally, the axle was replaced at this time because technicians said it looked like it had "failed". Dexter axle confirmed that the axle was "out of spec" due to unknown causes and the replacement was free.

The Dexter representative told me there would be insufficient clearance to mount a heavier axle on this trailer. But, the current design seems unsafe.

I wrote HI-LO explaining my concern and never got a response.

Has anyone else had a similar problem and does anyone have any suggestions on how I should proceed?

- Jack

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Hi-Lo 1707T - Tire Minder TPMS on Tow Vehicle and Trailer, 300W Solar Battery Charger, Equal-i-zer WDH, Progressive Dynamics Converter, Fan-Tastic Fan, LiFePO4 battery 12V DC Electrical System
2014 F150 Platinum 4x4 3.5L EcoBoost SCrew

You should weigh the trailer by itself to get the true weight. It sounds like you may have been hitched to the TV when you weighed it for the axle weight and have a WD hitch. That could affect some of the numbers.

By the way, where is the CD-132 located on you trailer? I have a 2310H and I cannot find any weight related stickers anywhere inside. There is a yellow weight sticker outside that gives 2664 pounds with no explanation at to what it means. That could be the cargo capacity.

I found this website that explains some of the questions we all have about weight. http://www.everything-about-rving.com/rv-weight.html

Rich, thanks for responding. I wondered about that, since a WD hitch might easily add to the axle loading. But, of course, I'm still running uncomfortably close to the limit, with an empty trailer! As things stand, the only "cargo" we put in there on trips is food in the refrigerator and our clothing and bedding - hardly much weight at all.

The truck scale people won't let me drop the trailer on the scale, but I could probably disconnect the weight distributing arms and just tow it up on the scale connected to the hitch ball. That shouldn't put any additional weight on the axle.

I've ordered a Sherline tongue weight scale and it should arrive tomorrow. That will give me a more accurate measurement of the hitch weight too.

The CD-132 form is pasted to the inside wall just to the left of the door. I actually took mine off, laminated it with plastic and remounted it, since I wanted it as a reference. The original glue that was holding it on pretty much "gave up the ghost". I suspect you may have had one, but it fell off at some time.

Edit: Thanks for the link!

- Jack

One thing you may want to do is not run with a full water tank. Put maybe 10 gallons in just in case you need some water on the road and then either fill or hook up to city water at you destination. The only time we fill up is when we are going boondocking about forty miles away from home. Short lower speed non-freeway trips are not as demanding on all the vital parts.

Thanks again, Rich. I've already gotten to that point. We tow the trailer with EMPTY water tanks, which is a bit of a pain. Since we almost always "boondock", I end up filling the tanks when we get there, by hand, using 5 gallon jugs and a funnel.

Once in a while though, we go places where there's NO potable water (or maybe no water at all) and then I have to fill the tank.

It's ridiculous, really. We have the "next to smallest" Hi-Lo made, and I'm worried about weight?

It'll be interesting to get an accurate measure of the tongue weight. If it's actually as high as my bathroom scale measurement indicated, it suggests the axle should be mounted a bit more forward. (The tongue weight was 564 lbs with an empty water tank.) There's room in front of the tires to do this, but it would mean the mounting brackets on the frame would have to be moved (a welding job). Just moving the axle forward by an inch would give me room to use larger tires, or 16" wheels and tires with a higher weight capacity. (I know how to do the calculation to determine a safe movement distance too.)

- Jack

See if you can find a heavier duty tire first, like a Load Range D. I don't know what is out there in that size, but that may be the best solution. It could require a wider wheel rim also.

I've actually done that Rich. I've put Maxxis ST205/75R15 LR D tires on the axle, which have a load rating of 2150 pounds at 65 psi. However, this brings up a possible problem with the rims, which I think are only rated to 50 psi! I have not been able to locate any 15" rims that are rated to 65 psi.

There are only a couple of manufacturers that seem to make LR D tires in the 205/75R15 size and the clearance between the tire tread and the step well on the right side is only about 1/2 inch. This is what is stopping me from using a larger tire such as 225/75R15 - the tire tread would contact the step well. All the LR D tires I've found require 65 psi too.

Personally, I think Hi-Lo has a questionable design here. And, I suspect the same problem may well exist with the 19T trailer too, since it uses the same 3500# single axle.

- Jack

I don't know if the pressure is an issue for rims, but if you go to a 225 tire you may need a wider rim. This is getting out beyond my school of experience, I will say no more.

It's OK, Rich. I didn't start this thread with the idea of not getting suggestions. You've actually been MOST helpful, because things you've said have triggered different ideas in my own mind.

And, I just used a better search string and found some 15" 5-4.5 bolt rims that ARE rated to 65 psi. The bad news is they are aluminum and are $84 each. I'll need to do a bit more checking to see if they are otherwise OK. (And, I'll keep looking to see if there's something else not quite so "fancy").

- Jack

Good Morning,

I also have been looking at the Maxxis ST205/75R15 LR D as a replacement for the OEM Marathon tires. I have the Eight-Spoke Dexstar wheels and have been trying to get a definite answer on their PSI capacity (Dexstar customer service is lacking). I will pull the defective tire tomorrow and check for a tag or stamping on the rim. I like the idea of a higher load-rated tire for the extra margin of safety. I also found the Sherline tongue weight scale and will be ordering one.

It seems I was blissfully ignorant during the time we owned our 1707 (tire wise) but am trying to be proactive with the 2310. I would hate having that little voice of doubt in my ear as we hurtle across Nebraska and into the Rockies this fall! Accurate weights, vigilant PSI checks, and slower speeds sound like the way to go.

Jack, thanks for the input on this subject.

Hi Jeff -

I have some new input now, and I may have been a bit "alarmist" in my first post.

My Sherline tongue weight scale arrived today and I promptly measured the hitch weight. According to the scale, the load on the ball is 460# for an "empty" trailer with no water aboard. My previous weighing using the "bathroom scale" technique gave me 525# for this configuration.

Working off the weight "placard" in the trailer, I estimate the total weight to be about 3131# (3001# UVW + 40# for propane + 50# for extra battery, + 40# for hoses, small propane canisters, a few tools, pots, pans & dishes that "live" in the trailer). So, the tongue weight is about 14.7% of the total, and the axle is loaded to 2671# when it's just sitting in my backyard. I'll go ahead and fill the fresh water tank again and re-weigh.

But, I'm still left with the "running weight" on the axle that I measured on the CAT scale with water in the tanks. It was 3320, which is only 180# under the axle limit. I certainly don't want to pull this trailer without a WD hitch, but if it adds that much weight to the axle, I can't help but wonder, "is the cure worse than the disease"? Clearly, I need to do another CAT scale weighing, both with and without the trailer to get a better idea of what's going on. This will have to wait though - I'm taking the trailer in for a brake repair on Friday and who knows how long that will take? (I'll start a new thread to tell you about that story too.)

I don't trust Goodyear Marathons at all now. So far, the Maxxis tires look fine and I feel better having them installed. The people at Discount Tire told me not to worry about the rims, and it's hard to believe an additional 15 psi is going to hurt them. If the axle loading stays at or below 3320, each wheel is seeing 1660# which is well within their limits.

We've taken the trailer on three trips into the Rockies, towing it over Monarch and Red Mountain passes twice (and the first time was with a Nissan Frontier)! That is not an area where it would be fun to have a breakdown.

- Jack

Update: By adding 36 gallons of fresh water (I made sure the water heater was full too), the tongue weight increased to 630#. So now, if the total weight of the trailer is 3430 (see previous post), the tongue weight is now 18.4% of the total (which is really too much). My WD hitch is rated at 600#! The hitch rating SHOULD have been fine, since the max load at the hitch should have been 3800 x .15 = 570.

So, I'm back to

1. Having the axle moved forward a bit (I just calculated moving the axle forward 2 inches would increase the axle weight by 40#, decreasing the tongue weight to 590#).
2. Finding lots of heavy cargo to load behind the axle (to "lift" the tongue).

We don't really carry that many "heavy" items when we camp, and I don't know how I could secure them even if we did. 12% of 3430 is a hitch load of 412# (about 2/3 of the current load), so I've really got a lot of leeway before the hitch becomes too light.

By the way, I think the heavy load on the hitch (it ideally should be 12%) is what is causing the WD hitch to transfer so much weight to the trailer axle.

Has anyone ever had experience with repositioning an axle?

- Jack

Hi Jack,

I cannot help with the axle calculation but will mention that I found 15 x 6 5 on 4.5 wheels on the eltrailers.com site @ 39.95 each with free shipping. The appear to be Dexstar wheels identical to what I currently have in 15 x 5. They are rated for 2050 @ 75 PSI. I found a local dealer who retails the Maxxis line and he assures me that the 205/75/15 (8 ply) will work on the six inch width. We upgraded to a 10,000 Lb. Equalizer hitch with the new trailer, so the other question mark is how the Dakota will do once we get up into the high country.
Now if I can justify the $ for new tires and rims!

Jeff

Thanks, Jeff.

I just sent an email with this concern to Hi-Lo's service department (asking about moving the axle). I'm following up with a respectful snail-mail letter to the President asking the same thing and giving more detail.

We'll see what happens.

I think I may have seen those rims. The ones I was looking at were rated to 2150# at 65 psi, which matches the tires. This is a link to them: Trailer Parts Superstore - 15" 5 on 4.5 Lug Aluminum Trailer Wheel Good to know that the Maxxis tires fit a 6" width rim. I need to check the center hole on our OEM wheels, but I imagine 3 1/8 will work.

- Jack

We took our 1705T from PA to AR twice and on numerous other shorter voyages and never had a tire problem, same tires as yours. And although we usually travel light I never thought that we had a weight problem. The trailer towed like a popup. We have a Reese Strait Line hitch with dual cam sway control. Our TV is a 2007 Toyota Tacoma 4X4 Crewcab. We now have the 2310H and it pulls nice also.

Thanks again, Rich. The User manual for my trailer gives the hitch weight as 320#, which is 12% of the unloaded vehicle weight of 2597#. It's got the factory installed awning, A/C unit, bunk bed, spare tire and extra OH cabinets, which would bring the UVW to 2973#. (Almost what the CD-132 shows at 3001#).

I'm certain the axle position is wrong now.

I'm hopeful the President of Hi-Lo will respond appropriately.

- Jack

Are you saying that just your trailer was not built correctly or that they were all built incorrectly?

Rich, I suspect it's just mine. They've certainly had a bunch of these on the road, and I'm the only one that seems to be having a problem.

- Jack

I found this page: How to Determine Correct Axle Position : Total Trailer, Parts and Services to calculate correct axle position.

I know it's not specifically for a travel trailer, but I think it would be accurate for one that is "unloaded", no fresh water or propane. In that configuration, I would want the tongue weight to be 10% of the total I think. Then, with water and propane added, hopefully the tongue weight would be close to 12% of the total.

So, when I get my trailer back from the RV shop, where hopefully, they will repair the brake, I'll do some accurate weighing and measuring and let you know what I come up with.

While I'm waiting for that though, if anyone has a 17 ft Towlite in the 2004-2009 model year range, could you possibly measure the clearance between your right tire tread and the frame that holds the folding step up into the trailer doorway? I have only 3/8' space here, which seems way too close (and the tire is not "centered" in the tire opening). I'm curious what others have.

Thanks in advance for anyone's input.

- Jack

Hi Jack
I have a 1703T 2003 model. I just measured between the tire tread and the bracket that holds the step and I have 2 inches. My tire is close to center in the wheel opening. I have had this trailer for several years with no tire or axle problem , I just got back from a Yellowstone trip in it that was 3000 miles and all went well.
I do see where having the axle to far back could cause problems and add to the tounge weight. Hard to belive the factory missed by that much on the axle position. That is a critical mounting location on a single axle rig.

Tom

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Tom
2003 Hi-Lo 17T
2013 Avalanche Black Diamond