2003 17ft towlite - won't raise - is it motor?
 

Trailer hydraulic motor will not come on to raise the trailer. It will lower it - had master certified RV service technician out to look at it - he troubleshooted for almost 2 hours and came to final conclusion that it must be the motor. The solenoid can be heard to make a noise when the button is pressed to raise but the motor will not raise up. You can crank it up and then the motor will lower it, but for whatever reason the motor is not kicking in to raise it. Battery is good - switch is good - wiring conections are good - transmission fluid level is ok - he added just a little but it is within one inch of top appropriately. Any ideas?

It's been up in my backyard since I brought it home and this is first time to lower it for travel. At first it wouldn't go down -- didn't seem like the safety bar would release - pushed the up switch to make sure it was up high enough to release - and it went up a little and then stopped and wouldn't do anything - either up or down.

When technician got there they checked a few things and then raised it up by hand so the safety bar would release -- thought that fixed it because it then lowered fine -- but it would not raise up with the switch - the motor just wouldn't kick in - so they checked switches, wiring, everything they knew to check and concluded that it must be the motor. Any ideas where to get a motor in Houston area or should I jsut call manufacturer and have one shipped?

Being so ignorant about electrical and hydraulic issues, I don't know what else to do but wait to see what the repair tech can come up with, we were supposed to take it out camping for first time this weekend, and would really appreciate knowing if anyone had other thoughts on what could be causing it to work on the lowering action but not the raising action.

I would double check the battery to make sure it is good before getting into messing with the motor. It may have some charge left in it but not enough to handle the load of the pump motor. If you can put jumper cables on and try raising it first that may tell you something. Motors just don't go bad from sitting but batteries can.

Jumping batter to test motor
 

The service tech did plug in to 110AC to test to see if it just needed more electricity - would that be same as jumping the battery?

My hunch would be the battery. It is possibly showing a "surface charge" of 12v and not having enough "juice" to energize the hydraulic motor. Did the tech try jumping the solenoid?

Bob

I agree with Bob. Clean the battery terminals & try it. Have the battery checked & or jump it from a good battery. I would bet it is a battery.

It would have to be plugged in for a reasonable amount of time to get the battery up to enough charge to raise the top, assuming the battery is taking the charge. Been there, done that.

on mine the motor does not run on going down, my bet its the battery you need to charge it or jump it. the charger built in the camper is a trickle charger.

sounds like the battery to me..

battery or motor
 

Good info about the motor not running when lowering. I found that out from Monarch today when I called. The trailer had been plugged in for about ten days prior to this problem starting, so hard to believe it's the battery -- and all lights inside shining brightly - plus technician said battery is good. The service tech did try to jump from the battery to the solenoid (is that the property terminology?) He called Monarch today and they seem to think it is the motor. I sure wish I knew RV repair in Houston area who is really experienced with Hi-Lo. But, I should be more trusting that these guys know what they're doing I suppose.

mine wouldn't do anything but click either because it was not level.
i had it at an angle for runoff.
once i leveled it it went right up.

Won't go up.
 

Amen to all of the previous posts that finger the battery. This is the usual culprit and should be checked first before you tear into the motor.

The HiLo RV system is very similar to a car system. Sometimes the battery can have a little charge. The lights work, horn works,etc. but the starter won't!! The battery must be strong and capable of providing the cranking energy.

Here is what I would check.

1. Does the battery read 12.6 volts?. Anything less will not effectively run the raising operation.

2. Are all cells up to the correct specific gravity and fully charged. A weak cell can bring down the entire system. Sometimes batteries can have a 'surface charge", the lights will work, radio play etc. but no big energy surge to run the motor. Note the following from my auto repair manual:

Cell specific gravity = 1.265 = 100% charge
= 1.190 = 50% charge
= 1.120 = discharged, dead

All cells of the battery must be around 1.265 specific gravity to have a strong battery capable of engaging AND rotating the motor. You can get a simple specific gravity float at any auto parts store. Cost less than $5.

3. Double check all connections for corrosion, clean, wire brushed, tight.

Then and only then would I tear into the motor. It is just like the starter motor on a car.

GOOD LUCK !

Ed,

Thanks for the terrific troubleshooting procedure. You should file this one in the HTL Reference Library. I've printed it out to tuck into my Owner's Manual.

Jim

Won't go up
 

Batteries can be deceiving sometimes. You can charge on and it will appear to have a full charge, but if any one of the 6 cells is weak it can preclude having enough energy to engage and run the lift motor. The motor is a high torque type which requires a 100% charged battery ( 12.6 volts AND all cells at peak specific gravity) No cell can be weak or shorting out full capacity of battery.

Also note that on lowering, you merely open a lowering valve and fluid bleeds back to reservoir. No great battery requirement here. A weak battery MAY lower the unit but will not raise it. You need a lot of concentrated energy to raise it.

Battery issue...raising
 

And, if the cells are not reading correct, then what's the fix?

I'm really, really, really lacking in knowledge about mechanics and electricity and realize that a Hi-Lo trailer might not have been the very best choice in that regard for my first ever trailer experience. So, what do I do if the cells in the battery aren't right, buy a new battery?

Even though my lack of technical knowledge should have precluded me from a Hi-Lo, I absolutely love it, love the uniqueness of it, love the ease of towing, etc. We had the maiden voyage this weekend, using the manual lift feature. The whole experience was even more fun and pleasurable than I ever expected. If I could just get it to lift without pumping the lever, that would be even better. Thanks for all your suggestions, I'm printing them out and adding to my manual.

Margaret, if the battery is faulty, the ONLY fix is to replace it. But, do you have jumper cables or some way to at least temporarily connect a "known, good" battery to the system? If you can do this, you can determine if the problem is indeed caused by the battery.

- Jack

Please DONT forget, that if the trailer is NOT LEVEL, it will not run the MOTOR! mine is more succeptable <sorry spelling could be off> to not wanting to raise, if the nose is down, than if nose is high! Get the trailer level in both directions, before you pull the pump, which I bet is a helluva job.

A bad battery, "should" at least seem to start the pump running then as it gets "any" pressure it will STALL. the motor on these pumps is a glorified medium duty truck starter, that runs a hydralic pump. The motor can develope its own issues of course, like dead spot on armature, bad or corroded brushes, broken wires on inner windings. let alone bad connections from selenoid/ or battery. Mine (might not be typical) will hear it run for 2 seconds at 1st lift after being let down for more than 1 hour, as it builds up pressure, then you see top move and the pump noise is louder. but when not level (as described above) the pump would not run, which scared the bejesus out of me, as I fugured "great, pump died" when I had just bought it.

If you haven't already checked this. Look at the battery cable/ cable clamp connection. Last year I was raising and lowering my camper doing some routine maintenance when it decided not to go back up. The interior lights worked. I knew the battery was in good condition. I tightened the cable clamps on the battery posts, still nothing. One time when I hit the up button I heard an arc and I saw a tiny bit of smoke near my battery terminal. The cable clamp was the original and of the type where the clamp is molded around the copper wire. The wire had become loose and corroded inside the clamp and was not making good contact. From outward appearance everything looked fine. Had I not seen the smoke I would have had a hard time finding the cause of the problem.

It's an easy and inexpensive repair.

Good point Thankful. I had a similar experience last year with my positive battery cable. It was the original cable (2001) and the battery clamp on the cable had deteriorated. Had to remove it from the battery to see it. Went down to the local auto parts store and bought a new cable. No problems since.

Bob

Margaret,

Please don't be disheartened regarding either your Hi-Lo, or your self described lack of technical knowledge. Electrical problems often appear very complex and confusing but generally have a simple cause. The real difficulty can be diagnosing that "simple" cause, a process that can give fits to even an experienced mechanic!

Hi-Lo trailers are not mechanic's specials! Many of us who contribute to the HTF love gadgets and like to tinker and improve our toys... so please don't misinterpret our many posts about doing this and adding that to be a reflection of Hi-Lo reliability. However, as with anything made by human hands, occasionally something on a Hi-Lo trailer wears out, or breaks, or stops working without apparent reason, and needs to be repaired or replaced.

The good thing is, that even if what you say is true about your lack of technical knowledge, you are certainly not lacking in common sense! You did well asking the HTF for diagnostic help, and you've gotten back some really terrific help!

Keep enjoying your new Hi-Lo...and don't give up on it (or your own confidence in operating it) because of a glitch at the start. This too, shall pass. :)

Jim

Let there be raising!
 

Hero of the Day!
RV Mobile Repairman
https://www.mobilervrepairhouston.com/
Office: 832-858-7986 service@mobilervrepairhouston.com

He showed up around 5:30 yesterday at my daughter's house in Friendswood near where I'm storing the Hi-Lo now and with 3 trucks (one HUGE) and six men - I told him right away I wasn't paying per employee (joking), but it seems as if their day was over in this area so they all just met here. Anyway, they talked about it being the motor, and tested the battery and solenoid, etc. -- then finally he asked for a hammer - assistant #2 brings rubber mallet type hammer -- "that's not a hammer, bring me a hammer!" head guy says....

Long story short - he hit (tapped) the motor (and there may have been a loose battery cable that contributed or not -- probably not, as other 12V appliances, lights, etc. worked fine) and the motor ground into motion - raising the top up with a bit of a louder noise than usual. He told me the motor was stuck -- possibly from not being used for 4-6 weeks, or perhaps just bushings rusted somewhat, etc. Or, from being in Galveston salt air/weather, or from freezing cold weather - whatever. He told me to plug it in, raise it (a little - not all the way) and lower it repeatedly every once and a while last night several times before I took it back to storage - and said not to store in Galveston for sure because of weather, and always carry a hammer with me. The "grinding" sound is gone and it sounds like it used to now.

EVEN BETTER HE DIDN'T CHARGE ME ANYTHING AT ALL!

Just thought you'd want to know...it was probably a combination of cold weather, Galveston salt air, horrible fog we've had this year, etc. Anyway - think I'll keep it up here in League City at least for this year.

Our maiden voyage this past weekend was great. We pumped it up manually and that was absolutely no trouble at all. The kids loved the Hi-Lo, and we had almost no problems whatsoever for the first time out.

The encouragement I've received from this Hi-Lo trailer form gave me the confidence to get out on the road. Thanks! And, I did tell this hero mobile RV repairman about all of the ideas y'all suggested. And, just kept pushing him to look for something else as I was sure the motor wasn't dead. He did measure the battery output and it was 12.4V - I told him I thought it needed to be higher to raise it, and he said he didn't think so. We saw the tiny circuit breaker inside the battery/pump box, and of course he said that wasn't the problem as motor was getting electricity. There was a little bit of corrosion on motor post, and one of the battery connections was somewhat loose. But, my new motto is now, "When in doubt, get a hammer!" Love it!

Just want to put this in this thread....

Another caution (your hero hopefully mentioned this to you) don't hit that starter when frustrated and angry or panic (because you give it extra force in the blows) and you'll will shatter the magnets if you go all "ape-feeces" on it. Go ahead, aks me how I know this... :D

What is the tapping on it doing (if lucky)? Tapping the motor, and the shaft inside is in a pretty strong magnetic field, and sometimes will turn just enough to get to where the armature (that is the shaft of the motor) finally gets a good contact via the brushes. Lots of times this is a cheap "brush" issue. Brush being carbon touching brass contacts on armature. other times it is a bad spot on the armature, and it will randomly "park" itself there. Rebuilder shops (for alternator/starter/generators) can usually test and repair, since replacing the pump motor itself might be hard to do.

Hopefully for you it was/is freaky weather related corrosion or something.

absolutely no heavy hitting....
 

Thanks, Sting -- for clarifying - he really did just tap it, and I'm pretty sure it is a case of brush corrosion. I'm going to look around for someone who specializes in re-building these kinds of starter motors, in case it ever comes up again.

Go figure ... of all the things it could have been. However, I've learned an awful lot by combing over the forum and exploring my little "Toto"....

No heavy hitting!

Well no problem... I grew up on a big farm in KS, had to learn to fix our own stuff, shop labor rates are higher than heck. so I have messed with a lot of stuff, ya know. plus cars/motocycles/campers even power tools are a hobby. Just dont ask me about plumbing, I get it, but it still baffles me ;)

I happen to post too much info, but many times that is because when I tried to find the info, I didnt find it all, and learned something the hard way as a result. So I am concientious about tryin to warn others from my experiences, or general knowledge. That is why I chime in, that is all.

And, remember the old mantra: "If it's broke, get a bigger hammer!" ;)

Great story, Margaret. I've fixed many things with a tap or two in my life, and they were usually electrical things.

- Jack

Good one, but Actually the quote I go by is:

OK, one last word from me about batteries. I looked in my auto manual and here is the summary of voltage versus charge on a battery:

Battery Voltage reading State of charge

12.6 or more 100%
12.4 to 12.6 75 to 100%
12.2 to 12.4 50 to 75%
12.0 to 12.2 25 to 50%

Bottom line any battery reading less than 12.4 volts probably won't have enough MOXIE to raise the unit. You got to have a fully charged battery, clean connections, no loose connections, no corrosion, etc. to make it.

I maybe a little late on this one but i'm new to this site. My wife and i just bought a Hi-Lo for the first time and it wouldn't raise up with he battery. checked this site and everyone said check the battery so i boosted i off i could hear silinoid ( not spelled right i know) but it wouldn't go up, so i tapped the pump a few times and up it went. Guess the pump hadn't been used in so long it ws stuck.

Welcome to the forum and as a Hi Lo owner. Spend a lot of time here reading the old post regarding the lift system and its related electrical system, really the only thing different than most other RV"s. Clean up all the electrical connections in the lift system and battery circuit. Make sure you have a good battery also. Ask question here on anything you don't understand. Check out the events heading here on the forum about the 2012 Hi Lo rally in the Pigeon Forge area. Come join us.

Hey,

Mine refused to pump, one time, because it was not level enough to safely go up I guess, it was while hooked to my truck, that had the tongue too high. Struck me funny though, it went up before at this "level" or so I thought. I leveled it out more, up it went. Im Not sure where or how this is detected or checked by the system though? Has to be some gravity thing, like seat belts have somewhere on pump or something?

The pump is a "automotive type starter" connected to a pump. Any alternator/starter repair place should be able to fix the pump...

If you tap too hard on a DC motor, you can break the magnets inside the case, go ahead and ask me how I know this, LOL.

IT is possible to tap on it I could be stuck, (edit: ok someone already posted that one)

But first!

1. Plugging in, is a trickle charging circuit only to charge the batter, it would NOT help get the top up, trust me.

2 I had a 6 month old battery in mine, I refused to believe it was the battery... Guess what? It was the battery! it would read 12v, until you put a load on it, then drop to less than 4v in about 4 seconds on a autozone auto motive battery tester (yeah I took it in to have checked on the machine)!

Batteries can fail at any time. just remember they make millions of these a year, there are going to be bad ones that get by ya know, mondays or fridays when shifts are about over, LOL.

I concur though, I would think the motor would at least turn then quickly die. Might have bad connections, you can jump directly to the big post that is going from selenoid to the pump motor with a good battery to test I guess.

Price
 

If yoyr dont mind me asking how much did rhis cost?

You do realize this is a 5.5 year old posting. The search tool is great for researching same issue from previous posters.

I recommend you start a new subject with your questions.

Give us a problem and likely we can help.

steve

If the brushes in the motor get gummed up they will not make contact with the stator to run the motor sometime a light tap with a rubber hammer at the back end will drop the brushes enough to make contact. Just tap it lightly no with a "BFH"

I have a similar problem. I think the solenoid that allows the motor to lift the body of the Hi-lo does not work. I replaced it once, but the part is not available any more from NAPA. Any idea of the replacement solenoid? Thanks in advance. Cheers, Rell

I dont know why it wouldn't be available from NAPA anymore. Take it off or take a picture of it and take it and ask again or check another auto parts store.

Rick

Try looking at Tractor Supply.

It is a Ford type solenoid.

Bob